Assault Ladder

[iRobot]

There is no farming on defense. If you're contributing to stopping the flow of attackers to the objective, then who cares.

Showing no interest in claiming objectives however, if that was the case, then I would agree.

Also Aza, I get the feeling that post was deliberate.

[Azarael]

Which post? I'm not being a dick here, I do think it's a genuine point to make. The play was within the rules and the offense seems to be that his style of play causes Izumo and Socio distaste. He's entitled to modify his style of play on skill maps if he wishes - a lot of people, including myself, do. It seems that 1000 deaths are being given for the offense of "playing for skill", and this is now a bridge too far. No warning or anything given.

If he is able to play in such a way that he doesn't die yet still trashes other players, he is able to produce that result either through awesome skill or because the map has some feature which allows him to do so. While I believe it's the former, if the latter were to be true that would not be his problem. The natural counter here is for you to argue that by playing in such a manner, he hampers his team's overall performance, but given my experience of his play I don't agree in the slightest that that's the case. Such a thing is for the acting administrators to prove.

[iRobot]

The natural counter here is for you to argue that by playing in such a manner, he hampers his team's overall performance.

Well as I said, if he was doing it while attacking, then the team suffers a net loss of one attacker. Hanging back and effectively "clearing the room" for your team is farming, if you make no progress to the objective yourself.

[Azarael]

It's clear from the thread that he does this only when defending.

Plus since when is there a rule on how to defend certain maps?

There's absolutely no case here at all.

[iRobot]

Camping in advantageous positions (see: shield spawns, heath clusters) only makes sense while defending and I do it myself. So add 1000 deaths to me too.

All top level play in almost every gametype, is about controlling the pickups.

[proof]

All top level play in almost every gametype, is about controlling the pickups.

This.
In 1on1 Deathmatch you time on every single pickup to get advantage over your enemy player. I do nothing else here. I collect health and shield pickups to stay alive and still add a big contribution on defending... in my opinion a even bigger one than if I would go into senseless spam combat.

Now my question to Izumo and Socio: What is the Shock Rifles Primary Fire and especially the Lightning Gun for? Riiiiiiiight, its for sniping or eliminating your enemy from a safe distance. So if you give the defender a Lightning Gun, why am I not allowed to use it? The best example is Hera here. Most people who play for skill jump into the Hellbender or the shockmine combo whenever they are low on health because they wont get 1 death credited when killed by a vehicle. I could do the same but I think THIS is just exploiting the skill-system. So what do I do on Hera?

One the first objectives outside there is a small shield and Lightning Ammo right beside on top of the defenders spawn plus a couple of other health/shield picksups down near the exit of the spawn. I of course stay near the shield and ammo on top and snipe them because Im safe there and I have an overview of the area below and all incoming attackers.

Lets take the objects inside with the 3 sentinels. There is a big shield in the hallway on top and some lightning ammo nearby on some boxes. Why am I not allowed to use these as defender if someone placed them there? I time the shield, I time the big health near defender spawn and I collect up Lightning Ammo whenever I need some and snipe everyone from those boxes whos coming close to the objectives. If someone is getting too close I even jump down and go into close combat of course. If someone is attacking/hurting me I dont run away like a pussy to stay alive but I fight no matter if I die or not. I defend just like everyone else just in a different way.

And in the end of the day Im usually topscorer in one team so you cant say Im wont defend at all.


In some other maps the defenders arent given hitscan weapons or it isnt even possible to camp (see Subrose inside of the building). What do I do on those maps? I dont spectate or fight only at the campable objectives (tbh defending is camping, just btw). I try my best and fight with all those fugly SPAMWEAPONS that require NO SKILL because they deal splashdamage and defend the objectives even if I lose skill during that process.

See, Im not just farming or camping everywhere. Of course I do so where I can. Everyone with great aim who doesnt camp near Shields/health/lightning ammo and goes into spam combat would be the biggest retard in UT2004.

I am defending.

[iZumo]

I chose 1000 deaths solely so the skill gets to 5.xx - 6.xx as a result, after reading the comments from Gasoline and discussing with Socio that behaviour Socio described in skill maps is considered as gaming the system and farming, when you're finding places for cheap killing and minimally contribute to defending objective (i.e similar to att style farming).

However I myself am only involved in making the actual punishment, so can't debate how much is that in order. We actually didn't write any rules for skill system abuse.

[Azarael]

If you're able to kill someone easily, aren't you fulfilling the brief of being a defender in the most effective fashion possible?

As he's already argued, those concerned with skill routinely game it by taking a death to a vehicle whenever low on health or fearing imminent death.

This is to whom it may concern.

[proof]

yea, I find it pretty unfair from Socio who exploits vehicle deaths to gain skill that he kind of reported me for "camping" which isnt actually forbidden. Everyone on the server who has played against me, know that I am a good player and that I deserved the skill I had. Im pretty sure I would beat Socio in a 1v1 fairly easily.

Part of log from Gasoline, 30.04
> team-spec*Socio: means you will camp in corners and frm lg kills
> team-spec*Socio: like you do most time on def
> BabyDontHurtMeNoMore: if this was a skillmap, yes

This is what you fucking do as a sniper. You dont say hey guys, here I am, kill me. You hide in a safe place and kill everyone getting close
Also, you admitted as well that I do it just "most time" not always.

______________

Other question: Would you report noobs who are trying the same thing but failing cause they dont have the aim/SKILL for it? No you wont, why do you report ppl who have enough skill to do it and actually do it successfully?

[iZumo]

If you're able to kill someone easily, aren't you fulfilling the brief of being a defender in the most effective fashion possible?

As he's already argued, those concerned with skill routinely game it by taking a death to a vehicle whenever low on health or fearing imminent death.

This is to whom it may concern.

By "cheap kills" I meant things like killing surprised unexperienced players 2km away of objective, not picking a good def spot.