wat

[Leecher]

Racism.

Racism is usually defined as views, practices and actions reflecting the belief that humanity is divided into distinct biological groups called races and that members of a certain race share certain attributes which make that group as a whole less desirable, more desirable, inferior or superior

NOPE.jpg

15 days for joking about holocaust

Can't be arsed to throw a definition of nazism in there, but making a joke about the holocaust sure aint in it. Neither is anything about that in the server rules. You guys could have warned for not allowing nazi jokes instead of instantly being a cunt about it and ban me for 15 days. I'd almost start making jokes about oppression.

[Azarael]

Racism was for a prior ban. The first poster's post subject becomes the thread subject, so first posts are edited when bans are added in later posts.

There is nothing in the rules about making Holocaust jokes because it's common sense. Spirit and not letter of the law.

Please note I didn't make this ban.

[giZmo]

You compare your oven with a place where one million humans lost their lives and you dare calling that a joke ?

[Leecher]

Some people even make a living doing that on stage, and whole countries laugh about those jokes. It's one of the things that come with a free and open society, freedom of speech and all that. Could have said you didnt like that kind of jokes instead of banning me for 15 days. I didn't offend anyone and if I did someone has to get a thicker skin. Freedom of speech is stated in the laws of many countries, including France. Thank fuck there are no laws prohibiting holocaust jokes, else society would go somewhere no free person ever wants to go (oh the irony).

I could not have known that my auschwitz joke was not allowed, because outside UT2k4 in pretty much every country (including Germany) it is and there is no server rule prohibiting it. Therefore the reason for my ban is based on a fallacy and I request it to be removed immediately.

I didnt mean to offend anyone and if I did, sorry for that mate. But please make sure to google how not to be offended in a free and open society, because the right not to be offended there is non existant. If it did freedom would come to a grinding halt soon enough.

[iRobot]

'Other people do it all the time' is never grounds for a good ban appeal.

Joking about massive loss of life may not be in the rules, but it's a pretty fucked up thing to do and I think you should take the 15 days and be grateful it's not 30 for being Nazism related.

[iZumo]

Yeah I myself would give 30 right away. Be glad you got just 15.

[Leecher]

Before you start calling anything nazism related you better look up the definition, because if you think you can relate this joke to that you clearly have no idea what nazism actually is.

And a pretty fucked up thing to do? By who's standard? How the fuck do I have to know I'm not allowed to make holocaust jokes if society doesnt make a problem about it and its not in the server rules? You know last week I saw this youtube video of this german comedian was chanting some stuff and the crowd had to follow, when he suddenly said SIEG and the crowd responded with HEIL. That video was from somewhere in the 70's and everybody laughed. Stop making a giant fuzz about jokes of something that happend 70 years ago. If you keep doing shit like that you will find yourself so cramped in political correctness you and your society will stop making any progress.

Dont go around and act like I almost support any form of nazism, like I'm close to a racist, like almost I'm supporting everything Hitler did and like I shit on everyone who stood against him, just because I made a joke that is socially accepted in pretty much every free wester society. If I would think like you I'd be offended right now for putting me in that corner.

[Jate]

I'd say he has a point. While this kind of jokes might be distasteful and offensive, not everyone see them as being outrageously unacceptable. Here's some reading on the matter:

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index ... 122AA3Y73r
http://alexdrinkh2o.hubpages.com/hub/Po ... t-a-Menace
http://cognoscenti.wbur.org/2012/12/04/ ... dy-kaminer
http://russiapedia.rt.com/of-russian-origin/the-gulag/
http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/arc ... 36118.html

(notice a few jokes about dark pages in Russian history)

I do understand that one must be cautious with these jokes, but it should not warrant an automatic ban. Of course, if they are spammed or it is clear that someone is being explicitly offensive - that's another story. Now, the chat excerpt from the ban post is not clear enough (imo, but maybe there's more), there's also a previous racism offence (might be related) - I'd reduce the ban.

[Leecher]

I could go and perfectly explain to you that being cautious about any joke is a very wrong and possibly dangerous thing in a free world. But that would take some text and this is not really the place for that.

I would just like to see my ban removed and a no holocaust joke being added to the server rule if its so important to you lot. As I explained I did not know it wasn't allowed. There is no reason to keep me banned, you made your point. A warning would have been sufficient.

[Azarael]

False comparisons ahoy, Jate.

We're not in a place devoted to satire and comedy. Allow offensive satire on the server and you can expect to hear it all the time, because then the admins have no teeth to moderate anyone.

I don't really understand the problem here. This is a game server, a place for playing a game. We who run it do not appreciate the trivialisation of important history in the form of satire. I'm sure some people do appreciate a mockery being made of every issue, no matter how personal, which exists in society at large - great. You're entitled to do whatever you want in public places and, indeed, permissive private places. Just not here.

While we're on the subject of implied politicial correctness, I must note that the only logical positions to hold in the debate are:

a) Full authoritarianism. Ban everything offensive.
b) Full libertarianism. Allow ALL speech. This will include allowing people to call each other racist nicknames. Would anyone like to suggest the difference between allowing mockery of the Holocaust and allowing mockery of race?
c) Reactive. Ban offensive speech as long as a member has actually found it offensive.

I feel it's time to sort this out once and for all and come up with a definite policy. So far, policy c) has been that of LDG, but it would appear that we have more than a few Stephen Fry devotees around.

It's now very common to hear people say 'I'm rather offended by that.' As if that gives them certain rights. It's actually nothing more than a whine. 'I find that offensive.' It has no meaning; it has no purpose; it has no reason to be respected as a phrase. 'I am offended by that.' Well, so fucking what?

Let's hear the positions you hold and the reasons for your holding them.