Prayers for the Children...Sad day in the States

[Azarael]

And when guns are illegal crime is committed with knives, or black market guns.

Except that the madmans won't get the guns, and oftenly won't be able to kill with a knife (concerning the Chinese article, it says WOUNDED, not KILLED).

If you can't kill with a knife, you are doing it wrong. Knives are dangerous even for trained fighters to face.

As we've seen, any space designated gun-free is a target for massacre. At least some personnel on site must accept their responsibility to protect the children and the other staff. I would be extremely surprised if there is no strategy which can be used to have armed defense within schools.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/14/world/asi ... index.html Gun laws state to state is a SOB in the States.You best know them.ATM in Michigan Laws was just voted on to be able to carry in School and Churches.Odds are it will pass np.We have to protect Children at all cost.You know 911 was bad.But this took the wind right out of my Sail. Michie

So you're telling me that a citizen, that purchased gun and is without any training, likely never shooting the gun, will be able to keep his head calm and intervene?

Hear a shot
Safety off
Cock gun
Shoot in defense of your own life and others. Sure, some people will freeze, and may be killed because of that adrenaline dump, but not everyone will, and at such close range precise aim is hardly an issue.

Why do you think shooters choose to attack where firearms aren't permitted? Because civilians can and do shoot back in defense of life. See the Charles Whitman shooting.

Edit: I've just discovered that teachers in Israel are armed.

[iZumo]

If you can't kill with a knife, you are doing it wrong. Knives are dangerous even for trained fighters to face.

I was refering to a psychopat, not a skilled / trained attacker. To me psychopat would not even hold the knife correctly and not dare to go and make a massacre like this with a knife.

So you're telling me that a citizen, that purchased gun and is without any training, likely never shooting the gun, will be able to keep his head calm and intervene?

Hear a shot
Safety off
Cock gun
Shoot in defense of your own life and others. Sure, some people will freeze, and may be killed because of that adrenaline dump, but not everyone will, and at such close range precise aim is hardly an issue.

Why do you think shooters choose to attack where firearms aren't permitted? Because civilians can and do shoot back in defense of life. See the Charles Whitman shooting.

Edit: I've just discovered that teachers in Israel are armed.

When you have trained reflexes and know exactly what to do and how to do it, perhaps. Otherwise your mind would be puzzled by a way how to get to the attacker safely, what is the distance from which I'm able to be sure that I won't miss etc. - it's not likely that you'd be in the same room as he would. And if you were in the same room, you'd be either be targeted first and killed as you'd be caught by surprise (if attacker expected that you're armed) or you'd have very likely tiny amount of time to arm the gun and shoot - it would merely have to be on reflex basis. So I don't really believe that many people would actually be able to act in such situation when they would have gun.

[Azarael]

Sure. Arming staff won't save everyone. But gunshots can be heard throughout the building and the minute the first is fired, other staff can prepare accordingly, whether defensively or offensively.

[iZumo]

Well yeah, but my point that getting a gun without training won't be very much practically helpful - definitely better alternative is to make sure such situation is prevented by getting the guns under a license, just as they are in our countries.

[Michie]

Well yeah, but my point that getting a gun without training won't be very much practically helpful - definitely better alternative is to make sure such situation is prevented by getting the guns under a license, just as they are in our countries.

In order to get a gun you have to get a background check. In order to carry a gun/Handgun you have to get a CPL.Which is alot of training.So others carrying gun are a hell alot more trained then most.Bad part is most everyone has hand guns.Theires an old saying .Guns dont Kill People.People Kill People.I like to think anyone in the world would have shot this kid Dead if they had a chance.Pointing the finger at guns is pointless.Its just an easyier way to do evil things.Reason i think everyone should be able to open carry in the USA like the old days.Lets see how many cowboys we really have when it comes down to it.I dought not very many.In Michigan you can Open carry a sidearm without a permit.But you cant go into stores banks churches schools.And you can not open carry in a car.As i said .Things are changeing for Schools and Churches here in Michigan.Every State has it own rules on guns.To be Honest i wish i could leave the States.Im tired of the madness and our Goverment which goes hand in hand.

[Azarael]

The specific issue in this case is that you cannot rely on the law to completely stop gun crime. The guns in this case were held legally by the suspect's mother. My view is that it's far better to engineer a situation where any attempted massacre can be cut short easily.

[Michie]

The specific issue in this case is that you cannot rely on the law to completely stop gun crime. The guns in this case were held legally by the suspect's mother. My view is that it's far better to engineer a situation where any attempted massacre can be cut short easily.

And that is Teachers right to carry gun in schools.However we cant force anyone too.In this case the school was locked down.He shot out the glass to get in.I wonder if the guns had locks on them ? Even so if they have some that are just child proof not adult proof so.Aza you come up with a way to keep our kids safe in school and youll be a very rich man.Other then almost a complete lockdown kinda like a jail i cant think of anything.On another note.The media was warned to leave the Familys alone today .http://talk.newagtalk.com/forums/thread ... 2#M2753572 . Pretty simple fix

[iZumo]

Primarily there should be proper gun licensing (including psychological tests with strict requirements), just as it works here in Europe (although the society here is pretty different). Only if that would be impossible then teachers should be able to carry guns but still with appropriate training (such as in Israel).

[Michie]

Primarily there should be proper gun licensing (including psychological tests with strict requirements), just as it works here in Europe (although the society here is pretty different). Only if that would be impossible then teachers should be able to carry guns but still with appropriate training (such as in Israel).

Im right with ya.But as the picture shows Open Carry.But in the States that wont go over to well with the Parents.Sad but True.And to keep our childeren safe in schools cost money.In the USA each State has rules.So does the Goverment.So they (Buttheads).Sad that life has come down to Money..

[Azarael]

Since America is pro-Israel, I'm sure once someone points out that Israeli teachers carry guns and that no children have been killed by them, there will be no problem - though admittedly service in the IDF is mandatory for all Israeli citizens.